Internationalists welcome?

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Internationalists welcome?

Post by JagreenL on Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:01 am

Hello, I'm a leftist from the USA, and I've been looking for a decent leftist forum for a while now. From what I've heard of RevLeft, the place is a complete mess that I'd rather not be bothered with, and it seems like a Revolutionary Syndicalist with Trotskyist leanings like myself might be welcome here at Socialist Phalanx. The only problem, however, is that I'm an avowed internationalist, and am generally suspicious, although not hostile, to nationalism (that said I fully support the right to national self-determination). I must admit, at first I though this site might be mostly for red-brown nazbol types, but upon further inspection, this does not seem to be the case. So, I ask, would a non-nationalist leftist like myself be welcome on this forum? If not, please let me know in a polite manner, and I will look elsewhere.

As to why I'm not a nationalist, well, I'm from the USA...
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Re: Internationalists welcome?

Post by Celtiberian on Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:24 am

Internationalists are more than welcome to join and post on the main forum. (Any posts opposed to left-wing nationalism will be redirected to the Cosmopolitan sub-forum, however.) Being that you support the self-determination of nations and are not entirely hostile to left-wing nationalism, I doubt there will be much we disagree on.

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"Nationality. . . is a historic, local fact which, like all real and harmless facts, has the right to claim general acceptance. . . Every people, like every person, is involuntarily that which it is and therefore has a right to be itself. . . Nationality is not a principle; it is a legitimate fact, just as individuality is. Every nationality, great or small, has the incontestable right to be itself, to live according to its own nature. This right is simply the corollary of the general principle of freedom."
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Re: Internationalists welcome?

Post by JagreenLern on Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:37 am

Good to hear, comrade. I look forward to many good discussions on this forum.

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Re: Internationalists welcome?

Post by Celtiberian on Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:45 am

No problem at all. Welcome to the forum.

Also, it may interest you to know that many of us who consider ourselves left-wing nationalists also support internationalism (myself included), albeit in a manner which cosmopolitans find disagreeable.

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"The dogma of human equality is no part of Communism . . . the formula of Communism: 'from each according to his ability, to each according to his needs', would be nonsense, if abilities were equal."
—J. B. S. Haldane Hammer Sickle

"Nationality. . . is a historic, local fact which, like all real and harmless facts, has the right to claim general acceptance. . . Every people, like every person, is involuntarily that which it is and therefore has a right to be itself. . . Nationality is not a principle; it is a legitimate fact, just as individuality is. Every nationality, great or small, has the incontestable right to be itself, to live according to its own nature. This right is simply the corollary of the general principle of freedom."
—Mikhail Bakunin Red Star
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Re: Internationalists welcome?

Post by RedSun on Fri Jan 20, 2012 11:02 am

Welcome to the forum.

As to why I'm not a nationalist, well, I'm from the USA...

It's important to draw a distinction between a nation (an ethnocultural group) and a state (a political group generally governed by capitalists). I doubt you'd find a single person on here whose definition of nationalism includes mindless support for the actions of their state; that kind of Tea Party nationalism, we all agree, is reactionary.

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Re: Internationalists welcome?

Post by Confusion on Thu May 24, 2012 11:42 am

Celtiberian wrote:Being that you support the self-determination of nations and are not entirely hostile to left-wing nationalism, I doubt there will be much we disagree on.

Isn't the self-determination of nations a very mainstream leftwing-view? Lenin, the anti-globalisation movement, Castro, my local leftwing-parties, all seem to agree on this. The way I have understood it, cosmopolitanism is a trait of the liberal right. To balance the nationalism , the left wants a strong UN - but the UN is built around the concept of nation-states, so it is basically nationalism without a racist or imperialist agenda.

Off course, those same mainstream-socialists I mentioned (The anti-globalisation movement, and my local socialist parties and groups) have also been friendly to immigration. The liberals/center-right wanted immigrant workers, and then the left got angry at the racialists who opposed that policy, using racist rhetoric.
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