Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by flatowkorps on Mon Sep 05, 2011 3:55 pm

By monkeys I meant thugs, not blacks/arabs/people of any ethnicity, I'm not a racist. They are acting against hard working people when they loot their property. If they are rioting against government, why aren't they attacking politics? It would be riot against government if they'd hang some people who are part of the problem on the trees.
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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by Celtiberian on Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:13 pm

flatowkorps wrote:They are acting against hard working people when they loot their property.

To my knowledge, the looting was confined to stores, thus, it was primarily the petite bourgeoisie who were affected by the London riots. The extent to which the petit-bourgeois shopkeeper is "hard working" varies considerably, and they don't exploit labor any less than stockholders or their bourgeois counterparts in larger industries do. I haven't lost any sleep over the losses they suffered in August, and neither should any socialist.

If they are rioting against government, why aren't they attacking politics? It would be riot against government if they'd hang some people who are part of the problem on the trees.

Politicians are nothing more than the paid representatives of capital. Attacking them would change nothing, as the epicenter of the problem lies in the economic base of society.


Last edited by Celtiberian on Mon Sep 05, 2011 6:13 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by TheocWulf on Mon Sep 05, 2011 4:59 pm

flatowkorps wrote:By monkeys I meant thugs, not blacks/arabs/people of any ethnicity, I'm not a racist. They are acting against hard working people when they loot their property. If they are rioting against government, why aren't they attacking politics? It would be riot against government if they'd hang some people who are part of the problem on the trees.

My thaughts exactly when they were looting large electrical stores or multi national companies I couldnt care less really but when they were attacking other working class people or burning other working class familys homes to the ground and setting there small business (and by small I mean small like the ones owned by little asian shop keepers who do 17 hour days and one man band or family mechanics ect) on fire I did.If a bank had gone up in smoke or Oxford street had got some id have lost no sleep but they didnt they burned there own communitys sad really.

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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by Pantheon Rising on Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:06 pm

TheocWulf wrote:My thaughts exactly when they were looting large electrical stores or multi national companies I couldnt care less really but when they were attacking other working class people or burning other working class familys homes to the ground and setting there small business (and by small I mean small like the ones owned by little asian shop keepers who do 17 hour days and one man band or family mechanics ect) on fire I did.If a bank had gone up in smoke or Oxford street had got some id have lost no sleep but they didnt they burned there own communitys sad really.

Gotta burn um down to build um up anew if you ask me. That goes for wall street and little old elm street in the middle class neighborhood.

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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by TheocWulf on Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:16 pm

Pantheon Rising wrote:Gotta burn um down to build um up anew if you ask me. That goes for wall street and little old elm street in the middle class neighborhood.

Well they didnt burn a middle class area they burnt there own working class one

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Take notice, That England is not a Free People, till the Poor that have no Land, have a free allowance to dig and labour the Commons, and so live as Comfortably as the Landlords that live in their Inclosures. For the People have not laid out their Monies, and shed their Bloud, that their Landlords, the Norman power, should still have its liberty and freedom to rule in Tyranny.-Gerrard Winstanley & 14 others TheTrue Levellers Standard Advanced - April, 1649

Cosmopolitan liberalism is a new ideological smoke screen for class oppression.-Kai Murros
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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by Pantheon Rising on Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:20 pm

TheocWulf wrote:Well they didnt burn a middle class area they burnt there own working class one

Like CeltIberian said before though it was mainly small business they burnt down. I don't think we can say it was an attack on working class homes.

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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by TheocWulf on Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:25 pm

so no working class homes were burnt then?
http://www.insidehousing.co.uk/tenancies/housing-association-homes-damaged-in-riot/6517137.article
Thats just the houseing association homes in Totenham.


Last edited by TheocWulf on Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:28 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Take notice, That England is not a Free People, till the Poor that have no Land, have a free allowance to dig and labour the Commons, and so live as Comfortably as the Landlords that live in their Inclosures. For the People have not laid out their Monies, and shed their Bloud, that their Landlords, the Norman power, should still have its liberty and freedom to rule in Tyranny.-Gerrard Winstanley & 14 others TheTrue Levellers Standard Advanced - April, 1649

Cosmopolitan liberalism is a new ideological smoke screen for class oppression.-Kai Murros
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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by Pantheon Rising on Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:27 pm

TheocWulf wrote:so no working class homes were burnt then?

I didn't say none. But how many were really destroyed in comparison to small businesses?

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"Whoever criticizes capitalism, while approving immigration, whose working class is its first victim, had better shut up. Whoever criticizes immigration, while remaining silent about capitalism, should do the same." ~ Alain de Benoist

"The main enemy is, on the economic level, capitalism and the market society, on the philosophical level, individualism, on the political front, universalism, on the social front the bourgeoisie, and on the geopolitical front, America." ~ Alain de Benoist

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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by TheocWulf on Mon Sep 05, 2011 5:31 pm

Pantheon Rising wrote:I didn't say none. But how many were really destroyed in comparison to small businesses?

How many working folk lived in the flats above these businesses?
The above link is for social houseing homes in Totenham id be intrested how many rented or private homes were burnt all over the country.Id imagen the social houseing homes that were damaged were maily in London though.

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Take notice, That England is not a Free People, till the Poor that have no Land, have a free allowance to dig and labour the Commons, and so live as Comfortably as the Landlords that live in their Inclosures. For the People have not laid out their Monies, and shed their Bloud, that their Landlords, the Norman power, should still have its liberty and freedom to rule in Tyranny.-Gerrard Winstanley & 14 others TheTrue Levellers Standard Advanced - April, 1649

Cosmopolitan liberalism is a new ideological smoke screen for class oppression.-Kai Murros
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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by Rebel Redneck 59 on Mon Sep 05, 2011 6:46 pm

Celtiberian wrote:Class struggle isn't something we have a choice in acknowledging or not. As socialists, it's incumbent upon us to recognize the fact that class struggle is endemic to the capitalist mode of production. Socialist revolution (be it guided by nationalist or cosmopolitan parties) will be advanced only through the contradictions of capital creating the material conditions which enable the proletariat to gain a sufficient level of class consciousness. National sentiments are only capable of generation revolution under conditions of occupation or colonialism, consequently, nationalism can only be a consideration after the revolution has occurred for most nations.


Well okay, to be fair, I should correct myself: The purpose of Hungarian Socialist Nationalism should be a national struggle against Capitalism. Yes your right class struggle is definitely capable of occurring under Capitalism. That is the mean reason I want to do away with Capitalism: So class struggle will have a low chance of occurring. I dont want my Nation to be divided into Proletarians and Capitalists. Nor do I want different classes going at each other's throats. In short: I am in favor of Socialism because I am in favor of National Unity.
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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by Pantheon Rising on Mon Sep 05, 2011 7:33 pm

TheocWulf wrote:How many working folk lived in the flats above these businesses?
The above link is for social houseing homes in Totenham id be intrested how many rented or private homes were burnt all over the country.Id imagen the social houseing homes that were damaged were maily in London though.

I have no idea. I don't live in London. I don't support the riots either, but I don't support the system and the police as well. Any good amount of action to stir things up is great. I am just saying the loss of the small businesses is no big deal.

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"The main enemy is, on the economic level, capitalism and the market society, on the philosophical level, individualism, on the political front, universalism, on the social front the bourgeoisie, and on the geopolitical front, America." ~ Alain de Benoist

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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by Celtiberian on Mon Sep 05, 2011 9:35 pm

Rebel Warrior 59 wrote:Well okay, to be fair, I should correct myself: The purpose of Hungarian Socialist Nationalism should be a national struggle against Capitalism. Yes your right class struggle is definitely capable of occurring under Capitalism. That is the mean reason I want to do away with Capitalism: So class struggle will have a low chance of occurring. I dont want my Nation to be divided into Proletarians and Capitalists. Nor do I want different classes going at each other's throats. In short: I am in favor of Socialism because I am in favor of National Unity.

As a left-wing nationalist, I obviously agree that one of the great benefits in establishing a socialist mode of production is the nation will no longer be divide along the destructive class lines capitalism generates, thereby enabling a genuine sense of unity to emerge organically amongst the people.

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"Nationality. . . is a historic, local fact which, like all real and harmless facts, has the right to claim general acceptance. . . Every people, like every person, is involuntarily that which it is and therefore has a right to be itself. . . Nationality is not a principle; it is a legitimate fact, just as individuality is. Every nationality, great or small, has the incontestable right to be itself, to live according to its own nature. This right is simply the corollary of the general principle of freedom."
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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by TheocWulf on Tue Sep 06, 2011 12:11 pm

Pantheon Rising wrote:I have no idea. I don't live in London. I don't support the riots either, but I don't support the system and the police as well. Any good amount of action to stir things up is great. I am just saying the loss of the small businesses is no big deal.

Well in the short term those working communities will be worse off becuse those working class small buisnesses corner shops,mechanics ect wont be replaced they will bang up a Tesco Metro and a Kwick fit.I think these riots have started a sentiment in this country,Talking to my workmates people are very angry with the government and are begining to see that they are only protecting themselves and there rich masters.The fall out from the evidence Libayan rebels have discovered about Britians cosy deals with Gaddafi just for the sake of oil has pissed people of aswell.There will be more riots but it wont look much like the last lot and the targets will be the system.

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Take notice, That England is not a Free People, till the Poor that have no Land, have a free allowance to dig and labour the Commons, and so live as Comfortably as the Landlords that live in their Inclosures. For the People have not laid out their Monies, and shed their Bloud, that their Landlords, the Norman power, should still have its liberty and freedom to rule in Tyranny.-Gerrard Winstanley & 14 others TheTrue Levellers Standard Advanced - April, 1649

Cosmopolitan liberalism is a new ideological smoke screen for class oppression.-Kai Murros
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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by Isakenaz on Tue Sep 06, 2011 3:32 pm

Still the uprisings of August in London are being described by many here as nothing more that criminality. Where is the evidence of anything political, we hear? There was nothing in the media to show any political leanings amongst the rioters, in fact every interview by the media both domestic and foreign shows a total lack of political aspiration amongst groups, or gangs, of underclass thugs whose purpose was cheerfully admitted amongst those interviewed as little more than glorified theft.

Yet evidence is now being uncovered that there were interviews where the ‘rioter’ interviewees spoke of the uprising as being an answer to oppression, police intolerance and the cut back effects on society, in other words everything that gives the event a political emphasis. But the media didn’t want us to see any of this, no it would not gel with their establishment-ass kissing.

Then we hear that if it had been political, then surely any action would have been taken against the higher-class areas with their houses and businesses rather than the poorer working-class areas that ended up being trashed? But the rioting started in Totenham not Westminster or Chelsea, so how would the ‘rioters’ than get to these more affluent areas, bus or taxi? Or maybe a noisy, but peaceful march? The areas that rose up were working-class areas, so it stands to reason that the areas that would sustain most damage would be those same working-class areas. And why have we so much pity for the small businesses which were destroyed? Are they working-class or petit-bourgeois?

And what of the police, the hard pressed servants of authority? Strange that for several nights all they could do was stand and watch as the ‘rioters’ burned and looted those working-class areas, before suddenly being able to flood the affected areas with reinforcements and establish law and order to the accompanying cheers of the local working-class who now rushed to join up with the middle-class clean up brigade in a comradely show of solidarity.

Wake up dear comrades, it was a put up job, encouraged by the establishment to allow them the introduction of ‘measures’ to deal with any future troubles. And before anyone screams ‘conspiracy theorist’, remember Thatcher and the miners? Scargill walked into a fight that he was meant to lose and thereby allowed the Tories, and the later Labourite governments, to enact a whole raft of anti-union legislation, with the result that the unions are the toothless lions that we have today.
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Re: Uprising: The Left in Britain (by the KPOB organization in Austria)

Post by TheocWulf on Tue Sep 06, 2011 3:48 pm

Isakenaz wrote:Still the uprisings of August in London are being described by many here as nothing more that criminality. Where is the evidence of anything political, we hear? There was nothing in the media to show any political leanings amongst the rioters, in fact every interview by the media both domestic and foreign shows a total lack of political aspiration amongst groups, or gangs, of underclass thugs whose purpose was cheerfully admitted amongst those interviewed as little more than glorified theft.

Yet evidence is now being uncovered that there were interviews where the ‘rioter’ interviewees spoke of the uprising as being an answer to oppression, police intolerance and the cut back effects on society, in other words everything that gives the event a political emphasis. But the media didn’t want us to see any of this, no it would not gel with their establishment-ass kissing.

Got a link or video? Id be interested as the sentiment described above I saw/heard afterwards by middle class folk in shirts on the news.

Then we hear that if it had been political, then surely any action would have been taken against the higher-class areas with their houses and businesses rather than the poorer working-class areas that ended up being trashed? But the rioting started in Totenham not Westminster or Chelsea, so how would the ‘rioters’ than get to these more affluent areas, bus or taxi? Or maybe a noisy, but peaceful march? The areas that rose up were working-class areas, so it stands to reason that the areas that would sustain most damage would be those same working-class areas. And why have we so much pity for the small businesses which were destroyed? Are they working-class or petit-bourgeois?

Thats a matter of opinion and I belive there is a thread for this matter already.

And what of the police, the hard pressed servants of authority? Strange that for several nights all they could do was stand and watch as the ‘rioters’ burned and looted those working-class areas, before suddenly being able to flood the affected areas with reinforcements and establish law and order to the accompanying cheers of the local working-class who now rushed to join up with the middle-class clean up brigade in a comradely show of solidarity.

The police leades are self serving criminals just like the military and political leaders of this country.They just watch there own back and try not to rock the boat.Oh and the clean up was a fucking joke paints the indigenous working class as pussys in my opinion


Wake up dear comrades, it was a put up job, encouraged by the establishment to allow them the introduction of ‘measures’ to deal with any future troubles. And before anyone screams ‘conspiracy theorist’, remember Thatcher and the miners? Scargill walked into a fight that he was meant to lose and thereby allowed the Tories, and the later Labourite governments, to enact a whole raft of anti-union legislation, with the result that the unions are the toothless lions that we have today.

Yea that wouldnt suprise me, but what has suprised me is that the anger in my work place and among family and friends is moveing away from the scallys and non indigenous folk but towards the government itself,So if it is a fit up I hope it back fires.

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Cosmopolitan liberalism is a new ideological smoke screen for class oppression.-Kai Murros
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